Help- House Training/ Crate Training Yorkie...

[mommy22boys]

So we got our Lab all trained and wonderfully behaved (for me at least )... then I decided I would love to have a Yorkshire Terrier for myself since the lab is more dh's pet.

So my yorkie is 13 weeks old now... got her at 10 weeks. So far so good with the house training. I go with her outside so I can praise her and bring her back in as soon as shes done going to the bathroom. When she has an accident, I take her outside immediately if I catch her in the act. If I just find it, I clean it up and leave it be because I read that showing it to them (or rubbing their nose in it ) and scolding them just makes them scared of going at all.

So here's where we have the problem- at night and while we are gone to work, we are trying to get her crate trained because obviously we can't keep an eye on her if we are asleep or not home so we don't want her pooping under furniture and such and us not knowing its there. Well, that and also the fact that she's so small we've actually lost her for more than an hour twice... and that's when we were here and (thought) we were keeping a close eye on her. So I'm scared I would come home from work and she would never be found again! lol.

Anyways, the crate training- it's terrible! I have never seen such a thing!! Every morning and every day when I get home from work the kennel floor, door, and the pup are COVERED in poop! I mean, like no kidding, she will poop then she must literally roll in it and stomp it because it will be all flat and mushed into the whole floor of the kennel. The kennel is technically for a medium-sized breed dog so I was using the training divider at first. Then I took it out thinking she must not have enough room. But it's still the same situation every time! I thought dogs naturally learn not to use the bathroom where they sleep. And if they have an accident, I would think they would do it in one corner then stay away from it. Whats the deal!? I've asked around and some people said she is probably doing it on purpose because she's mad that she's being left in there. Well, that would make sense if she was only pooping... but rolling in it? It seems that would be miserable to her, not me! I just don't know what to think of this! Could it just be that she is so upset from being in there that she doesn't realize she's running through her own poop? I know that small dogs have smaller bladders and bowels... but she really isn't in there that long. DH leaves for work at noon and I get home no later than 4:00. And DH usually stays up till like 2:00am and I get up at 6:00. So about 4 hours is how long she stays in there. I guess 4 hours is long for a dog her size but it's not like I put her in there for my whole 8hr shift! We always take her out right before putting her in.

And the poop isn't diarrhea. It's just regular poop, but ran through so much that it creates a thin layer ALL over the kennel.

I'm just hoping to get some advise as to whether anyone else has ever heard of this... or if you think she will grow out of it? I don't mind bathing her 2 or 3 times a day.... however, I don't think it's good for a dogs skin to be washed that much... is it? Cleaning the cage sucks but I keep hoping each time that she will want it to stay clean and not throw a feces party in there!!

She has a vet appointment next week and I will ask about it... but I don't want them to run expensive tests on her bowels or something like that if this is a "normal" stage for puppies.

Any help?!

[Smee]

Some dogs really stress out about being confined and/or alone. I doubt she's spite pooping. I'm not a fan of "just enough" room. I prefer roomy crates with toys. I would start trying to change her perception of it by putting her in there for meals. She is very young and it is also possible that she just plain doesn't have full control yet so that when she goes, she's very stressed about being confined with poop in addition to being stressed about being confined at all. Honestly? I'd work on litterbox training so that she has an alternative. I know people are all, "yeah, but I don't want them learning that it's ok to go in the house." I'm all about damage control, and given a choice between scooping poop from a litterbox or cleaning ground in poop from the dog and the crate, I'm going with the easier option. I've done this with several neurotic small dogs, and none have ever been unwilling or unable to eventually transition to fully outdoor pottying. If you decide to try litter, just train her as you would for any other spot. Take a urine soaked tissue or a poop you've picked up, put it in the litter, and encourage her to go there. Word of warning-- avoid the scoopable clumping litter until she learns that it's a potty area and not a playground. If she were to get it in her mouth, it would be a real choking hazard since scoopable litter becomes concrete like (BTDT, thought my dog was going to die!). Of course, if you see her eating either type, take it away. You could certainly try those puppy piddle pads if you want. Whatever works. My dogs just always shredded those. Some do great. If you can give her an indoor potty option until she's more mature, you may be able to take her out of the crate completely and therefore she may settle down on her own and end the cycle of stress pooping.

So... try feeding her in the crate or giving her favorite treat there and let her come right back out, and try litterbox training?

[cupunlvr]

Is there a bathroom that you could keep her in during the day while you are at work and at night?

Thirteen weeks is still very early to be left in the crate for extended periods of time. Although I didn't like the idea either, the vet that I work with in animal rescue suggested to me decreasing the size of the crate by using a divider when I was working with a foster dog with the same issues as you are having.

Although really gross to come home to or wake up to, if it makes you feel any better, it is stressing you out more than the dog. Best of luck, yorkies are such characters!

[Smee]

I'm with you, cupunlvr, on not wanting to see crates used as longterm arrangements or for extended periods, and I agree that a safe room like maybe a bathroom is a good idea, but I don't dismiss the notion that the puppy may be very stressed. IMO the puppy is at an age to be learning lifelong habits and tendencies whether they be nervous and anxious or happy and calm, so at this point, I'd be doing whatever I could to minimize the anxious behavior. For sure, I'd do whatever I could to keep the puppy from becoming comfortable with being caked in poop (not that I'm suggesting that that's what you meant).

My vet also suggests shrinking their space. Sometimes it helps and sometimes it doesn't which is why I think it's important to be able to create individualized alternatives instead of seeking blanket solutions. I don't think we've ever handled two of our fosters exactly the same! One of our old guys will probably always have to eat his meals in a specific spot in the dining room (for example) because that's what keeps him from pooping there. At this point, I'm for whatever works. They done gone and wore me down.

[mommy22boys]

Thanks for the ideas! I think I may try the bathroom idea... should I just buy the training pads and put one down in the bathroom? I have never used the pads... is there something about them that attracts the dog to them? Or should I expect that she will just use the bathroom on the floor too? Or am I supposed to cover the whole floor with the pads? Do I need to secure them down a certain way?

I can't do litter because DH would rather have cats than dogs and my excuse is the litterbox. lol

[Gertie2u]

A word of warning about the training pads. I know this is not something that will always, always happen, but don't discredit the possibility of your dog outsmarting you. Only reason I mention it, we used piddle pads made from old newspapers and a rubber tray meant for snowy or damp boots and shoes for my first pup when I was a kid. As puppy got the hang of things, we transitioned her away from the piddle pad to always doing her business outdoors. Or so we thought. Then came the night my dad was trying to look over the expensive blue prints for our new house we were planning to build. My mother heard my dad's shout of surprise from the other end of the house and quietly hustled us kids into the bathtub. Mother joined us in the bathroom that night and quietly shut the door, spending most of our bath time sitting on the commode chuckling softly to herself.

Yeah, that dog hadn't used a piddle pad or peed indoors in probably four years at that point. And never had bothered the newspapers we often left scattered around the living room floor, especially on weekends. The only thing we could ever figure was it was because dad had the blueprints spread out on the kitchen floor to make it possible to mark errors and changes easily and it was near where we had kept the piddle pad back when puppy had used them.

[Justmeinflorida]

I know some people won't agree with me on this one BUT I've trained a lot of dogs in my day and I was a vet assistant for many years. I've also rescued and rehomed many abandoned/abused/stray dogs and I've always used a kennel when we were away from home and at night for sleep. Small puppies can get into a lot of trouble when not confined and you're not around to monitor them. I would take out the divider and put down a puppy pad at the back side of the kennel. At the front I would place a small double bowl with some food and water. Take a blanket and cover the back and sides of the kennel, this will make your puppy feel more secure. Your puppy might be feeling insecure because the kennel is so big and she has no way to get out and cuddle with anything or hide under something to make her feel safe. I would add a small Kong filled with treats to keep her stimulated and busy (you can fill them with Kong filler and dog really like peanut butter ). Also two or three small stuffed toys to play with (rub the toys on you to give them your scent). You can even place a baby blanket in the kennel with your scent on it for her to cuddle with. Make sure that whatever toys/Kong you give her stay in the kennel (find what she likes best and ONLY keep them in there) this will encourage her to like her time in her kennel and that being in it is more like a treat then a scary place.

If haven't already started clicker training, you can PM me and I can give you some great advice...HTH!

[mommy22boys]

Well I had to scratch the bathroom idea because I guess I didn't really realize before that there's a pipe that runs from the floor to the toilet. It's behind the toilet so people don't really see it but it would be a great place for a little puppy to go and have a chew fest. And she's definitely a chewer.

I tried the blankets and toys in kennel last night while we were gone to hockey game for about 3 hours. No poop or pee in there when I got home! Yay! Hope this works!

[Justmeinflorida]

Well I had to scratch the bathroom idea because I guess I didn't really realize before that there's a pipe that runs from the floor to the toilet. It's behind the toilet so people don't really see it but it would be a great place for a little puppy to go and have a chew fest. And she's definitely a chewer.

I tried the blankets and toys in kennel last night while we were gone to hockey game for about 3 hours. No poop or pee in there when I got home! Yay! Hope this works!

Yay! So glad it worked for you...remember she's just a puppy and will have some accidents but it looks like you found something that's working for you.

[mommy22boys]

No pee or poo today or yesterday!