My 5 year old daughter is a ruffian, I need advice.

[queenofthehivemomof5]

I don't know...is she hitting, biting, pulling hair or otherwise showing signs of aggression? You know she is 5, it will take some time for her to find her place amongst her peers. She may very well indeed be a leader, and that is not necessarily a bad thing. Some kids are leaders and some are followers. And sometimes those rules change as they get older.

I have 2 very bright children too who are also on the aspbergers spectrum and although they are brilliant they sometimes lack social skills. My son Parker started getting some help with that at 5 and is doing much better. While my daughter Hannah did not start to get help till much later. But sometimes they are very blunt and while they don't mean to come off as rude or mean, sometimes it is the way it comes off.

Your daughters comment about the stuffed duck sounds like something one of my two would do. Bringing in something very litteral like "you did not take care of the duck so it died" into the make beleive.

I guess I would asscess bullying if your daughter knows that her actions are hurting her friend and she continues to do it. Otherwise she is probably not mature yet in that area. It can take some kids longer than others to learn empathy and she may need to work on her social skills with role playing.

[Deja Vu]

Thanks for your response Heidi. No, no biting or hair pulling or anything of that nature. She does enjoy rough play though, and is very physical when playing with boys, likes the pushing and shoving and wrestleing. I sometime wonder if she is trying to get a rise out this child purposefully to insite this type of play.
When you talk of adding the "very litteral" part, that was what was a bit frightening. I can see a kid saying; "here's your dead duck." or something of that nature, but the rest of it was what really bothered me.

[VivaciousJewelz]

If she is not hitting or biting, that is a good sign. Like others have said, sometimes kids need more time to learn social skills.

You might try implementing a positive reinforcement system. For example, whenever you see her playing "nicely" with her friend (when there is no communication or interaction that concerns you), you should tell her how proud you are of her that she played nicely with her friend, and give her a small reward, like letting her do something she likes to do for a few more minutes than you normally would. At the same time, whenever she is not playing as nicely as you would like, perhaps you can try sitting down with her and talking to her, or not let her friend come over the next day so she sees there are some consequences for her actions.

She is not doing anything really harmful to the other children (at least, not that you've said), so IMO there's no need for punishment per se. Keeping the positive and negative reinforcement small (subtle things), instead of outright punishment might work more in your favor for gradually helping her learn to play better with others.

[wealthybarney]

Deja-Vu-Your welcome:) I wish I could remember the name of that book I saw on TV -it was a guy in his 60's who had a book on how to eliminate unwanted behaviors in kids & teenagers--he had years of experience & success.

He was on DR.PHIL(sometimes he annoys me)--but his website may have it. Less money than a counselor. Oh, the other thing she said about a kid who is a leader: sometimes they may have a high IQ, & this causes loads of problems because they are so far ahead of the other kids & don't understand how to process this & act out. Happened to my Sis, who had to leave the 7th grade, & go to a University early entrance program. Yes-Sis went to College at age 12! Graduated from College at 16, finished her Ph.D in Psychology at 20 on a scholarship. Who knows? You may have one of these on your hands.

[Sthrnmissgal]

Hey, just wanted to give alittle bit of my own personal experience with a child who seemed to be much bigger and aggressive than other kids her own age. My daughter from day one has always been much bigger than kids her own age. As an infant she looked like a toddler and so on. She was our first and for almost four years she was our only. My husband had no experience with babies, let alone girls, so he bought footballs and jersey's for sports teams for our daughter. Because we are military, there was no family to have her around other little girls, and none of our friends had kids. Our daughter become overly aggressive from playing rough with my husband. She did not mean to be rough with other kids, and to this day we still laugh when we remember how some of the smaller kids would run when they saw her coming because when she hugged them she would squeeze them! What I would always tell me DD from the beginning is to "Be Nice!". It seems as if I was saying that constantly for the first 5 or 6 years of her life. I constantly told me daughter that other people don't like to be hurt and don't like for people to be mean to them. I would always ask my daughter "Would you like someone to do that to you?" Now my daugher is 11 1/2 years old and a mother hen of sorts. All of the younger kids flock to her because she mothers everyone. I don't know if that is because of my constant preaching to be nice and to help others out or if that was on her on accord. So, IMO, it sounds to me like maybe your daughter in her mind is being nice, because my DD thought she was too. It just took alittle bit of guiding her to what nice was. I also overemphasized (SP?) when she was nice and gentle. I made a big deal about it so she really knew that that behavior made me happy. I hope some of this helps. Just keep you head up and know that because you are concerned that you are helping to make a difference. Good luck to you and your DD. -

[Deja Vu]

Positive reinforcement is good advice, thank you! I made the mistake of leaving her at home when I dropped her friend off which caused natural hysteria and was negative. I felt awful for doing it, but I wanted her to think about her behaviour. She is normally good natured and loving and known to be caring and helpful in addition to leading at school. I don't want to believe, and don't think she thinks she is being purposefully malicious.

Originally Posted by regbyandjulie You might try implementing a positive reinforcement system. For example, whenever you see her playing "nicely" with her friend (when there is no communication or interaction that concerns you), you should tell her how proud you are of her that she played nicely with her friend, and give her a small reward, like letting her do something she likes to do for a few more minutes than you normally would. At the same time, whenever she is not playing as nicely as you would like, perhaps you can try sitting down with her and talking to her, or not let her friend come over the next day so she sees there are some consequences for her actions.

[Deja Vu]

My goodness that's quite an accomplishment!
I do know that my daughter is very intellegent, not genius; but a quick study. She has quick wit, and a quest for knowlege. I do worry though, she has used it to be coniving at such a young age; and I just don't want her to grow too fast. I think this will pass and she is just behind socially. I just want to make sure I do everything I can to deter in a postive way the atypical behaviors along the way.
And that starts with the wonderful advice so many of you have shared.

Originally Posted by wealthybarney Oh, the other thing she said about a kid who is a leader: sometimes they may have a high IQ, & this causes loads of problems because they are so far ahead of the other kids & don't understand how to process this & act out. Happened to my Sis, who had to leave the 7th grade, & go to a University early entrance program. Yes-Sis went to College at age 12! Graduated from College at 16, finished her Ph.D in Psychology at 20 on a scholarship. Who knows? You may have one of these on your hands.

[mama22qts]

Originally Posted by wealthybarney Deja-Vu-Your welcome:) I wish I could remember the name of that book I saw on TV -it was a guy in his 60's who had a book on how to eliminate unwanted behaviors in kids & teenagers--he had years of experience & success. He was on DR.PHIL(sometimes he annoys me)--but his website may have it. Less money than a counselor.

Are you talking about Dr. Kevin Leman?

Or maybe James Lehman?

[momof2inohio]

Hmmm.. I really dont know what to tell you. Wealthy Barney had some really good advice for you. My daughter looks and acts much older than she is (she is 7 but people think she is 8 or 9). We had some issues with her trying to "mother" other children. She was never mean, just always wanted to be "helpful" which isnt a bad thing I guess but I didnt want her to be bossy towards her friends.

[mama22qts]

I think that when she starts to interact more with children at school, she will learn to be gentle. I am dealing with something sort of similar with my son -- he's always got to be the boss. He will be 8 in a couple of weeks. My DH and I have told him that no one will want to play with a kid who always insists on playing by HIS rules, and he is unfortunately finding that out.

I hate to see him hurt like that, but sometimes as a parent the best thing to do is to let them experience the consequences, then help them deal with the fallout.

BTW, my son is going into the 3rd grade, and the only label he has at school is 'the really smart one who always opens the door for everyone.' That's what the teachers think of him, and the girls love to play with him, and most of the boys.

It's not going to be as bad as you think.

As far as discipline goes though, this might be something that you really need to work on. Children thrive on consistency and knowing where their boundaries lie.